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August 4, 2008 |  32 comments |  Print | E-Mail Your Opinion  

Grigol  Ubiria

Russia's Neoimperial Policies Make Georgia and Ukraine Seek NATO Membership

Grigol Ubiria: NATO’s eastern enlargement is too often solely considered from the perspective of Russia’s right to defend its interests on its borders. Little or no attention has been paid to factors forcing former Soviet republics, particularly Georgia and Ukraine, to rush to join the alliance.

Russian political mentality has been extremely reluctant to accept the fact that the Soviet Union ‘passed away' over a decade ago and that Russia is no longer the only major player in the post-Soviet sphere. Russia's former president and current prime minister, Vladimir Putin even lamented the breakup of the Soviet Union as "the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century."

Under the influence of neo-Soviet nostalgia and revanchist nationalism, the Russian political elite still considers the territories of the surrounding post-Soviet republics as Russia's backyard where a Russian version of the "Monroe doctrine" can be imposed. In their view, it is just a matter of time before Russia re-establishes itself as a regional and global superpower and re-asserts its interests in the international arena. The Kremlin perceives obstruction of further expansion of NATO as vital since the alliance is considered to represent the biggest threat to Russia's neo-imperialist ambitions.

From the perspective of the West, NATO's enlargement has not been a military threat to Russia since the end of the cold war. Quite on the contrary, admission of Central and Eastern European countries to the alliance has made those regions more stable, democratic, and prosperous. In fact, Russia's own failure to build a reputation as a trustworthy neighbor in terms of security and to dissolve the re-annexation fears of the former Communist satellite republics encouraged those countries' integration in NATO.

In the case of Georgia and Ukraine, apart from their legitimate wish to integrate into the Western democratic community, the unwillingness of Russian foreign policy makers to provide security guarantees and to respect the sovereignty and territorial integrity of those republics has been the primary push factor for the two to bid for NATO membership. Instead of engaging in a meaningful dialogue with Georgia and Ukraine, Russia chose to use its energy and military muscles against its neighbors. As an illustration:

  • In Ukraine, despite the popular support for pro-Western candidate Victor Yushchenko during the presidential elections of 2004, Russia openly supported recognition of fraudulent election results to ensure the victory of pro-Russian candidate. Allegedly, during the presidential campaign, Russian security forces even tried to kill Yushchenko by dioxin poisoning. Since 2004, ‘energy blackmail' has been a favorite political tool for Moscow to punish Ukrainians for choosing the pro-Western course. Last year, Putin even threatened Ukraine to target it with nuclear missiles if it joined NATO. Some Russian politicians have even called for Russia to disintegrate Ukraine, particularly to take the Crimean Peninsula from it and to support separatist movements in largely Russian speaking eastern parts of the country.
  • In Georgia, Russia has been largely responsible for provoking separatist wars in Abkhazia and South Ossetia. With the help of Russian official and paramilitary troops, the separatists conducted ethnic cleansing of Georgians in both regions. All attempts of Georgian government to solve the conflicts peacefully have been blocked by Russia. Moreover, while ethnic Georgian refugees are not allowed to return to their homes, Russian citizens have moved from various parts of the Russian Federation to occupy their properties in Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Both separatist regions have been tightly controlled by Russian military and security forces. In direct violation of all international laws, Russia has broadly granted Russian citizenship to Abkhaz and South Ossetian separatists and pledged to defend its new citizens if Georgia attempted to use force to reassert control over those regions. As a reminder, Nazi Germany used similar tactics against Czechoslovakia prior to its occupation in 1938: during the 1930s Hitler massively granted German citizenship to ethnic Germans living in the Sudetenland, the western part of Czechoslovakia. Later, in order to ‘defend' German co-nationals, Nazis invaded Czechoslovakia.


Moscow's pursuit of neoimperial policies towards Georgia and Ukraine has left no alternative to those countries but to seek NATO membership.

There is no doubt that Russia's security concerns should be heard. However, Russia has to learn to respect security concerns of its neighbors too. Moscow has no right to dictate Georgia and Ukraine or any other country to reverse the pro-Western course. Neither should Western powers betray young democracies in the post-Soviet sphere because of increasing dependency on Russian energy supplies.

As for Russia, it would truly benefit from vigorously developing its democratic institutions. Running the country better than President Yeltsin and selling oil for higher prices during the world oil crisis are not signs of great leadership. Russia should understand that bullying neighboring countries by supporting separatist movements will neither alleviate Russian security concerns nor will it deter Georgia and Ukraine from having pro-Western democratic aspirations.

Grigol Ubiria is a PhD scholar at the Australian National University.

 

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Tags: | NATO | Ukraine | Georgia | Russia | energy security |
 
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Unregistered User

August 4, 2008

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Dear Grigol Ubiria,
I am afraid you have it all totally wrong. You should realize that Russia was, is and always will be a dominate country in Euro Asia and moreover in world affairs, whether you like it or not. If we ever hear of an Aussie in orbit or constructing supersonic airplanes, atomic power stations, I might probably have to change my mind.
The disintegration of the Soviet Union was a terrible catastrophe and Putin was absolutely right. It tore families apart, disintegrated the economy, gave a rise to nationalism, and left many of the regions of the former Soviet Union in distress. Please do not mix disintegration with the fall of communism.
The language you are using makes me admire and wonder where you picked up your imperialistic, neo-Soviet, revanchist vocabulary.
As to NATO amicably surrounding Russia. I am sure that nobody would feel secure being surrounded by a “friendly military block” led by the US. Have the patience to study Iraq. Then again, I do not believe that entrance into NATO make the member countries more prosperous as no military block is ever intended to boost production; quite on the contrary it ingests resources. The European countries united to their own benefit and could have done that without forming any military block and lived just as happily. If anything, NATO helps to pacify disputes among member states, if you know anything about the history of Europe.
As to territorial disputes. Russia has no territorial disputes with either the Ukraine or Georgia. Georgia has a dispute with a former Republic that was integrated into the Georgian republic by an order of Stalin. In 1992, Georgia started warfare on South Ossetia and killed thousands of its citizens. I thought you should share a thought for them. Just the other day bus loads of children were being evacuated to North Ossetia to save them from Georgian shelling Tsinval their capital. I should remind you that Russia troops are stationed between arguing sides conforming to a UN mandate as are the number of these troops. Over 150 Russian soldiers have lost theirs lives trying to keep warring sides apart. If Russia leaves the place before any agreement is reached it will end up in a blood bath for either side.
Now to granting Russian citizenship. How would you feel yourself if you were deprived of your Australian passport? I guess you would be posted up in “Down under” for the rest of your life. Living in Europe is somewhat different, you must have a passport to cross borders should you want to visit a relative, a football match in Moscow, even if it is in a former Soviet Republic more so Europe, America or even a yachting tournament in Sydney.
Imagine for a moment that Australia disintegrated and split up into states, each with its own passport and laws. Do you think you could manage the passport control without a document? You probably could, but you would finally end up in jail. These people had been in isolation for 15 years, none of the documents issued by the local authorities were recognized anywhere. Russia was holding an embargo – no trade, no transport, no Russian visiting South Ossetia etc. Measured imposed by the UN and strictly followed by Russia. The Kosovo precedent changed this situation and Russia slacked border control, and just days ago finished assisting in restoring railway transportation.
Retaliating to your example concerning the issue of passports to the people of South Ossetia, I should guess they would have agreed to Hitler issuing them a passport if it allowed them to travel or cross the border of their country and safely return without being cross-examined for illegal trespassing or what is worse arrested. I believe that the average Aussie never cares for a passport unless need urges him to cross the border of the country. I assume that 90 % of Australians have never seen what a passport looks like unless they have had the privilege to leave Australia. I do not mean swimming too far away from the beach and even in that occasion you will eventually be stopped by border patrol boats. Ever tried to smuggle a couple of apples from Victoria to NSW past the vegetation control? So, give them a fair go mate!
The Ukraine signed a treaty in which the Russia float may remain in Sevastopol until 2017 and determined the borders between Russia and the Ukraine. Another clause of that treat says that the treaty remains valid only on condition that the Ukraine does not enter any military block opposed to Russia. This clearly means that should the Ukraine enter NATO its territorial integrity will be seriously undermined and if any military infrastructure opposed to Russia appears there, you bet Russia will have them in rocket range.
As to those notorious Russia establishing oil prices. You should know that oil prices are not set by Russians or any other nationality; they are a refection of the market. Until recently, the Ukraine had serious problems paying from Russian energy resources and never paid nor pays anywhere near European prices. The main pipelines carrying gas to Europe pass through the Ukraine. Enormous amounts of gas aimed for Europe buyers were regularly drained off Russian pipelines, facts recognized and registered by international intermediates.
As to the “popularity” of Victor Yushenko. You might not know that the US had a steady hand in organizing and financing what we call today a “colour” revolution in the Ukraine that ended up in Yushenko being elected. By coincidence the same happened in Georgia. I doubt not Yushenko is popular in the western world; I wish he were just as popular in the Ukraine. Though, I do regret that we did give afford some moral support to his opponent.
As to “Russia’s” poisoning Yushenko. Three year have passed since the “poisoning” and there has not been the slightest proof that any Russian had anything to do with it. The investigation will go on forever and will evoke in the form of rumours any time someone wants to find fault in Russia.
Cheers mate and don’t be so harsh on Russia.

Valentine Akishkin
Tags: | in support of russia |
 
Dániel  Antal

August 4, 2008

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What is puzzling to me is that the EU is far from being a superpower, and it can afford to turn down such great countries like the Ukraine or Georgia, who wish to be its economic, political and military allies.

I think it truly against the interest of Russia that these countries join NATO, but it is the interest of the current NATO countries. The reason is the same as the reason for the Ukraine and Georgia to seek NATO membership: the Russian foreign policy that we politely call 'assertive'. Last year's cyberwar against Estonia is a good example why we would feel more comfortable with the frontiers moved a few hundred kilometers away.

Russia can still remarkably threat countries, but it looks it still lacks the power to make friends.
Tags: | EU |
 
Heinrich  Bonnenberg

August 5, 2008

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Mr. Ubiria,
You equal Adolf Hitler with Mr. Putin.
That is extremely scathing and absolutely unacceptable.
You should immediately apologize to Mr. Putin and to Russia for this dishonour using this Open Think Tank.
Heinrich Bonnenberg
Berlin and Moscow

Besides, you really do not know Russian history, not Russian problems, not Russian civilisation and also not Russian feelings. I am very thankful for Valentine Akishkin's comment above.
Many internal problems are extisting in Russia. Caused by this, actions in foreign affairs have happened which are only understandable if you have knowlegde about the internal situation. For my understanding as a friend of Russia, those actions are nearly normal with such a procedure of enormous internal changing which is happening in Russia. I am very sure that the responsible people in power will solve them all, for benefit for the Russian people.
Russia is a very important part of Europe. Why are not Europeans always and always trying to disturb this partnership?
 
Sonja  Davidovic

August 5, 2008

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Gentlemen,

thank you for your contribution.

With all due respect, I believe we should cease mutual accusations and indignities.
This place is an open think tank, but the openness of this platform is supposed to serve a higher purpose - to generate new constructive inputs for political decision-makers in the region.

The international community has been facing serious challenges in Georgia in the last couple of months. I believe the separatist conflict in Abkhazia paired with raising military escalations in South Ossetia are worrisome to all of us, no matter on which side of the border we stand. Instead of looking for culprits, we should focus on more productive things such as the search for concrete and viable solutions to existing problems. It should be obvious that solutions can only emerge from a tolerant, civilized and respectful dialogue.
Ironically, the common inhibition of real dialogue actually causes crises to occur in the first place.

Next to the US and Russia, the European Union is committed to fostering peace in the South Caucasus. The European Union’s Political and Security Committee (PSC) agreed on the proposal to expand the EU’s role in resolving the conflict in the Abkhazia region of Georgia.

Let's bundle our expertise and optimism to formulate recommendations that would help assuage the tensions in the region. Imagine we were brokers in a peace process sitting together at the negotiating table...

What is the lowest common denominator between Georgia's territorial integrity and the Abkhaz right of self-determination? What is the broadest possible autonomy that the Abkhaz region can obtain? What are the concessions that the Georgian and Abkhaz leadership are willing to grant to each other? What is the link between the recent military escalations in South Ossetia and Abkhazia? Is South Ossetia being instrumentalized to stalemate the negotiations on Abkhazia?
How can the EU expand its engagement in the South Caucasus? Can the EU take a more conciliatory role between US and Russian interests in the region? How viable is Foreign Minister Steinmeier's three-stage peace plan for Abkhazia?
And lastly, does NATO need a more explicit communication strategy stressing that not Russia is the persona non grata? Can there be a transatlantic security system that engages Russia? Does Russia's newly appointed military envoy to NATO signalize a turning point in Russia's relations to NATO?

Take on the burden of stressful peace negotiations for a moment. You will soon realize how much more difficult it is to negotiate peace than to accuse and blame. A tough job like that deserves respect, gratitude and most of all support. By negotiating peace international peace brokers keep us safe from further bloodshed and destabilzation. So, let's be constructive and try to help them out.
 
Unregistered User

August 5, 2008

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NATO, a rotten relic of the cold war, is trying to survive; it is trying to show that it's still relevant. In the process, it alienates Russia, builds new wall, and encourages new arms race. It’s a shameful disservice to the people of Europe and the rest of the world.

Mr. Ubiria, as a university scholar, should base his writings on research and facts, not on his political views. After all, he is talking to these naughty Eurasians on behalf of sophisticated western world.
 
Marek  Swierczynski

August 5, 2008

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With all due respect to all: please respect everyone's view equally. I have the impression, that here some views are more equal than others. The Author has stirred up the hornets nest - that's sure - but why slam him personally and deny the right to publish??? Why the right to judge someone elses' views should be restricted only to those few "true Europeans"??? This reminds me of... yeah, I'll stop short here. Neither is an article on a Open Think Tank forum a piece of academic reserach - unless otherwise claimed - and should not be judged upon academic strandards. And by the way - did anyone see any piece of academic research on Hitler's policies published or conducted in time of his rule? Perhaps, but times were different then and very few readers have had access to it. Anyway, please once again, do not change this forum in a PR vehicle for a certain set of views on foreign policy, please respect views of others, even if they do not represent a dominating stream or a "truly European" approach and please let anyone be compared to anywhom, because it is always and only the Author of the comparison that bears the burden of being silly. And all of us have a right to be silly at times.
Tags: | freedom of speech |
 
Marek  Swierczynski

August 5, 2008

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And a note to Mr Akishkin - and maybe his supporters also. You say: "Cheers mate and don’t be so harsh on Russia", quoting alleged lies, half-truths and plain mistakes of the Author. But he did not outline 1% of what should be there - if his article was an indictment. For instance: how about murdering a foreign national in a foreign country by an agent of Russia's secret service and by a mean that should send shivers down the spines of every decent man on Earth, especially someone who cares about world's peace and non-proliferation as much as I'm sure Mr Putin does...
Tags: | Litvinnenko murder |
 
Heinrich  Bonnenberg

August 6, 2008

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All Europe has unique common roots, but each country has man made strengths and weaknesses, a sui generis nature based on its living conditions and on its history.
A basic rule should be that each country and each of its persons in charge have the right to be esteemed, if they are not criminal, and that we all live according our promise: "And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive them that trespass against us".
Vision, constructive criticism and mutual respect are the only tools to design our common European future.....which we have to find most urgently because of our competitors around.

 
Unregistered User

August 6, 2008

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Dear Marek Swiorczynski,
Please read this article that related to the murder of Litvinenk. It might help you to draw optional conclusions.
The Specter That Haunts the Death of Litvinenko
By EDWARD JAY EPSTEIN, Special to the Sun | March 19, 2008
http://www.nysun.com/foreign/specter-that-haunts-the-death-of-litvi...
 
Grigol  Ubiria

August 6, 2008

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Dear all,

First of all, thank you all for your comments. Although I don’t think that there was any counter argument made to debunk my opinion about Russia’s true motives behind its resistance to NATO enlargement, let me still respond to some of your comments.

Mr. Akishkin, I don’t think that I ever questioned in my article the importance of Russia not only in Eurasian politics but in the world affairs too. Russia is a huge country with enormous resources and it will always have a say in the international arena. The issue is not Russia being a strong power but what type of politics it will pursue globally as well as domestically. For example, the Soviet Union enjoyed the status of a superpower for decades but it was all about repression, violation of human rights and dictatorship. It is exactly the importance of Russia that makes the international community worry where current rulers of Kremlin are heading the country to. I believe that nobody wants to have a transformed Soviet/Russian Empire around.

Like Putin, Mr. Akishkin believes that the fall of the Soviet Union was a catastrophe. He even tries to present it as a tragedy of millions of Soviet families that drove them to economic and personal miseries. But what Mr. Putin actually lamented about was the vanishing Soviet/Russian dominance in many parts of the globe. Loss of control and influence was exactly why Mr. Putin defined it as a geopolitical catastrophe.

Instead of questioning the need for NATO’s existence and its intention to grant membership to Georgia and Ukraine, Russians should have asked themselves what makes their European neighbors rush towards the Alliance and why none of its bordering countries to the West feel secure from the Russian side. If none of your neighbors trusts you, then I guess you should at least bother to ask yourself what the reasons are.

NATO is not an independent ‘underground’ military organization. It is a voluntary alliance of 26 independent democratic states, including USA, UK, Germany, Belgium and Italy. Most of these countries have good relations with Russia, especially Germany. However, Kremlin, in the very Soviet propagandistic style, still portrays NATO to its citizens as an anti-Russian organization. If Georgia’s and Ukraine’s accession to NATO is a threat to Russian security, then say Germany, one of the key members of alliance, should be considered the same threat to Russia.

As a friend of Russia, Mr. Bonnenberg asked me to apologize to Mr. Putin and to Russia. I beg you pardon but I really don’t think that I should apologize to Russia. Has Russia apologized for Communist crimes, occupation of Caucasian, Baltic and Eastern European countries? As regards to Mr. Putin, let me give you a hypothetical question (a similar one was used by a British journalist Edward Lucas): if a former Nazi SS officer had become a Chancellor of Germany and called the fall of the Third Reich the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century, restored Horst-Wessel-Lied as a national anthem of Germany and threatened neighboring countries to target with nuclear missiles in the case of joining NATO, would you still ask me to apologize to such a person for comparing his policies to one of the dictators of the last century?



 
Unregistered User

August 6, 2008

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NATO - non-military oganization???
 
Unregistered User

August 6, 2008

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Russia, as any other responsible country, must act (and act fast!) if a military alliance is getting closer to its borders. Russia is quite different from the Soviet Union and NATO expansion is a military provocation that may turn very costly to the world.

Second, when Putin spoke about the Soviet Union catastrophe, etc., he clearly explained that he meant the human dimension of the problem (millions of Russians, Ukrainians, Georgians and others ended up living abroad, high poverty level, etc.). I guess it’s customary for some news outlets to pick a sentence out of context.

Generally speaking, the west has shown its inability to embrace a multi-cultural multi-dimensional world, with its variety of political views and opinions. As a result, the world architecture has become unstable. The west must understand that different countries have their own neighborhoods, security interests, etc. It demands (often with weapon in one hand and a dollar bill in the other) political and cultural assimilation from everybody who is different. It’s a loosing strategy! The west is too stiff to acknowledge that it must change to survive; its cloud is gradually fading out...

(Russian/Ukrainian living in the West)
 
Unregistered User

August 6, 2008

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Dear Grigol Ubiria,
I have traveled quite extensively around Australia together with a group of friends meeting with a wide specter of ordinary people, authority functionaries, businessmen, scholars, governors of states, even with the representative of the queen in Australia. We did not miss the aboriginal reservations either. I hate the word “reservation”. They were a very, very, awesome sight to witness. I always wondered why these people were and continue to be so disagreeably and neglectfully treated. Filth, dirt, no commendable medical care, no accessible education, locked up in the least commendable locations of the Australian continent. I am not talking about a hundred years ago, I am talking about today. I did not notice that these indigenous people were bestowed any legitimate rights that the rest of the Australian citizenry enjoy.

Extract from the history of Australia:
The Indigenous population of Australia at the time of British arrival on the Australian continent (1788) was estimated to have been at least 750 000. A vast reduction in the Indigenous population occurred with the arrival of the British. The Indigenous population reduced to under 200 000 from 1788 to 1861, then down to 62 000 in 1921. Such a drastic reduction in population was due in large part to the arrival of introduced diseases. The British colonizers brought diseases which the Indigenous peoples had no natural resistance against. Another factor causing the Indigenous population decline was genocide (murder or mass killing) at the hands of the British and Europeans.

Please note that only half of the initial figure reflecting the population of 1788 remains today.
The words “colonialism”, “genocide” “, “mass killing” sound very much like the lexicon you used in your article while describing the features of “communism”, don’t they?
The aboriginal leaders, we met, were extremely abrasive when they commented to us on their life and rights in Australia. I did not notice much scorn in the faces of representatives of Australia’s establishment when we spoke of the situation either. Neither was there any commitment to tend seriously to the situation. By coincidence the people of Abkhazia were treated by Georgians in a very similar way. The chauvinism of those days is paying back today.
Please note that the history of Australia, though very short, was and still remains filled with ignominy and discredit. Should we talk about other colonies of the British Empire, or carry on with the discrimination of Negroes in the US or dwell on any other European country; I leave it to your choice. Please show me a faultless “democracy” with an unstained history that regrets and scorns over its dispiriting history. Does the US mourn over the thousands of killed, and displaced in Iraq. Has the US demonstrated any regret for its carpet bombings using cassette bombs, and napalm in Vietnam? Have they paid a compensation for the losses, has any US president openly denounced US for murdering thousands and thousands of Vietnamese people using the most vigorous means of warfare. Isn’t one of the candidates to US presidency promising to win that war in Iraq and half the population of that democratic country is ready to cast a vote in his favour?

CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHY WESTERN DEMOCRACIES ASIGN RUSSIA TO A SEPARATE LIST?

Gorbachev named 27 million as the number of Soviet soldiers and civilians that perished in WWII, demographers estimate the loss as 44 million. (Australia lost 23 thousand). 200 thousand Soviet soldiers died freeing one city - Riga the capital of Latvia from fascists. Remember please that the Baltic countries were, and remain to this very day very reverent to former Nazi accomplices. Want to visit some of the memorials set up recently commemorating Nazi accomplices.
There is some mention of a “terrible” Russian cyber attack on official Estonian government sites in one of the comments. The Russian internet surge started on the day Estonia began dismantling a very honoured monument dedicated to the Russian soldiers who died freeing Tallinn - their capital. Are those soldiers guilty of anything?
I advise you to make an experiment and ask 10 random Australians on whose side the Russians fought in WWII. You can easily do that with your students. You will be surprised with the answer. That’s to the role of propaganda and the source from where James Bond stories of the treachery of Russians appear.
I invite you to visit Russia and see things first hand as I did in Australia and other parts of the world.

I sent my earnest and warmest gratitude to Sonja Davidovic the editor of the Atlantic Council for her effort to return this vigorously debate into a more praiseworthy and fruitful path. Thank you Sonja for your comment, it seems to be the most omniscient of all that has been cited herein.



Tags: | in support of russia |
 
Grigol  Ubiria

August 7, 2008

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Dear Mr. Akishkin,

Let me remind you that Australia has nothing to do with Georgia’s and Ukraine’s bid for NATO membership. Neither discussing the history of Australia would shed the light to the transatlantic security policies nor will it explain Russia’s neoimperialist ambitions in “near abroad”.

Many thanks for offering me to visit Russia to gain first-hand knowledge of your country. I might do it in several years. As regards my current familiarity with Russia, trust me, I have a quite good knowledge about your country, its history and culture. For your information, I am a PhD scholar at the Australian National University but I am not Australian citizen. I am citizen of Georgia. By the way, many of my ancestors also gave their lives during the WWII fighting fascism and the memory of their sacrifice should be respected. However, that does not make me to change my opinion that Russian Soviet Empire was evil.
 
Unregistered User

August 7, 2008

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Mr Akishkin, I appreciate your interest in and comments on the maltreatment of the indigenous population in Australia. But you missed a very important and big part to the story. Australia is not in denial about clear violations of human rights of indegenous people. Quite on the contrary, Australia understands the need to remedy historical injustice. And trust me, Australian government and society at large does work hard to put in place right affirmative action programs to reduce social inequities and promote opportunities for indegenous population. It is also quite remarkable that a National Sorry Day was introduced in Australia to acknowledge the ill-treatments of indegenous people and to officially apologize.



 
Heinrich  Bonnenberg

August 7, 2008

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Gesture of Repentance and Apology
On December 7, 1970 West German Chancellor Willy Brandt dropped to his knees before the monument to the Warsaw Ghetto uprising of 1943.
Willy Brandt's famous gesture has been a silent apology done in the name of Germans past and present to the victims of the German atrocities in the Warsaw ghetto as well as in Eastern and Middle Europe.
This image of Willy Brandt kneeling has become a symbol of accepting the past and of understanding it as an obligation for reconciliation for a common future.

We Europeans are thankfull for this attitude of the Chancellor of Germany. I is an important fundament to create EUROPE. Let us go ahead with EUROPE. Squabble, venoms and nontruth have counter-productive effects to EUROPE, which other people might need, not the Europeans.
 
Michael  Schuster

August 7, 2008

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@ Heinrich Bonnenberg

If Putin were a great leader of a great country, then he would also drop to his knees in order to apologize for the Gulags and deportations and the crushing of the uprising in Hungary etc.
 
Unregistered User

August 7, 2008

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I think we should be fair and remember that Russian people have suffered from communism as much as other countries of the world, if not more. If we follow this logic, we should ask president of Poland for apology because Felix Dzerzhinsky, KGB creator, was Polish; Georgian President – because Stalin (Dzhugashvili) was Georgian; German Chancellor – because Karl Marx, Lenin’s “teacher,” was German, etc. We can go too far if we choose this road.

Russian people, along with people of many other countries, were victims of international communism. They are trying to re-build their lives.

 
Unregistered User

August 7, 2008

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With regard to NATO expansion, it’s still possible to find a reasonable voice among west politicians and policy planners. Below please find a link to a Financial Times article written by the head of policy planning at the Italian ministry of foreign affairs: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/27e33696-63d1-11dd-844f-0000779fd18c.html...
 
Unregistered User

August 8, 2008

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The 14th of October 2007 Yushenko signed an ordinance glorifying former Ukrainian Nazi associates.
Spare a moment and drop in here to see just who these “resplendent soldiers” were. See: http://ukr-ww2.onestop.net/


 
Marek  Swierczynski

August 8, 2008

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It is a sad but symbolic coincidence that while Participants of this forum discuss the Russian-Georgian-Ukranian relations the tension in Transcaucasia erupted in violence. While Georgia is to blame for an apparent failure to peacefully solve the situation in South Ossetia, Russia is accused not only for supporting the separatists but for being active militarily on their side. At the moment we know too little to say whether in fact Russia has attacked Georgia, but should that be the case, many comments above would have to amended immediately.
Tags: | Georgia | South Ossetia | Russia |
 
Unregistered User

August 8, 2008

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For your information Tskhinvali – the capital of South Ossetia is being heavily bombed by Georgian C – 25 aircaft. Georgian troops using armed vehicles, tanks, rockets units, artillery are blasting the city to pieces killing civilians and destroying housing. Large contingents of Georgian infantry are now on the outskirts of Tskhinvali. There is fighting in the streets of the city. Casualties have been reported among the Russian peacekeeping contingent as Georgian peacekeepers opened fire on them. People are flooding to North Ossetia. Georgia declared war on Ossetia three hours after Sakashvili declared a ceasefire. Hospitals and rest homes of North Ossetia are being used to home refugees. A humanitarian column of trucks was attacked from the air. Georgia refused to provide a humanitarian corridor for Tskhinvali refugees. The situation is desperate.
Due to the attack on South Ossetia, Abkhazian is rounding up volunteers. The same is going on in North Ossetia. It looks like Russia will have to take more acute measure to stop the bloodshed.
I do not share you humour about Russia bombing anyone in Georgia! Blow your pipes man and see if you can change your source of information, your ears are definitely in the wrong place.
There is no doubt that Sarkashvili would never have started the blood shed without getting a confirming nod from the US administration. His army was equipped, armed and trained in NATO countries. Bush is about to resign so who cares, about this mess that Russia will have to mop up. It will definitely put some extra weight on the scales in favour of Mac Cain. That is about the last Bush can do to assist his adherent. There is really nothing that can spoil his “popularity” even if he openly admitted approving Sakashvili’s intervention in South Ossetia.
By the way you demonstrated specific interest in Russia’s “poisoning” conspiracies. I will try to send you a photo via the message board of the Atlantic Council of Mr. Yushekno that was taken three months before the so called poisoning. The photo was taken in June 2004 and the poisoning was said to have taken place in September. Draw the conclusions yourself.






 
Unregistered User

August 8, 2008

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Gia shalom. Having read your interesting article and the comments I'm again coming to the conclusion that the leftist ideas are the only cure to the world's problems. I don't mean the extreme leftist ideas like pronounced in for example "counterpunch", but rather a mild leftism, which means the desire and actions mainly on the part of the superpowers (cos they're strong) to gradually apply the democratic principle of "equality" not just within thier own countries, allies and unions, but rather in the entire world.

It is possible that such actions to bring equality will not work immediately and soon as many people in the world would like to happen. But until the genuine desire and actions to divide as much as possible equally the world's natural resources and power are absent, there always be claims and reasons to demand apologies from one person/state/superpower by another.

I would like to beleive that the leftist ideas are applicable, but maybe they are not, as rich and powerful states will supposedly be never keen to give up their power with others. It remains to me to beleive that a third world war will not be needed to bring after it (if something remains after a nuclear war) a comprehensive world peace which will be based on the principle of equality.

So, athough I support Georgia's joining to NATO, but what I wanted to imply is that in the long term such alliances either of Georgia or of any other state with any entity, will not help to the well being of the people and the nations fo the earth. The alliances can help and bring a desirable change in the short term, but not in the long one...
 
Unregistered User

August 9, 2008

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Sonja Davidovic writes "next to the US and Russia, the European Union is committed to fostering peace in the South Caucasus"

sorry, but do you really think that Russia is committed to fostering peace in the South Caucasus?!

I don't think so - Russia wants the South Caucasus to be its colony.

Unless this happens, Russia wants permanent war and destabilization here. And, unfortunately Russia has been achieving this goal quite successfully.

Do you really believe Georgia would have serious problems in its regions, if Russians didn't invade?

Georgians were never really fighting with Abkhazians and Ossetians. Georgians were fighting with Russian army and still are.

Russia has imperialistic ambitions.

Why doesn't Russia want peace in the Caucasus? Because Russia doesn't want stable and independent Caucasian countries. There are many reasons for that. Energetic policy is one of the reasons. Russia obviously doesn't want a competitor in the energy supplies...
Another reason is Russian propaganda. As you may have noticed from Mr. Akishkin's post, Russian propaganda is based on the idea that Russia is and should be a superpower and an empire. And to prove this, they need to invade at least some small countries periodically. And it seems they think Georgia is an ideal target.

It's very upsetting that the western European community is so calm when Russia is bombing the whole territory of Georgia. On the second day of the bombings hundreds are already injured or dead. and what's the justification for that?
Doesn't the old Europe see the reality?
Or is the world just accepting that it can't do or doesn't want to do anything in such a situation?
 
Donald  Stadler

August 9, 2008

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I have read commentsby Herr Bonnenberg many timeson this blog celebrating Russia's 'European' values. Most edifying. European Values are without doubt an Excellent Thing.

Are current events between Russia and Georgia as perfect an expression of 'European Values' as previous ones between Russia and Chechnya, or between Russia and Ukraine (a certain poisoning of a major political figure is what I have in mind).

If so, what does that tell us about Europe?
 
Heinrich  Bonnenberg

August 10, 2008

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To Grigol Ubiria and Michael Schuster:
Russia of today is a federation with two houses of parliament, a democracy with four parties in the lower house Duma. Russians travel to each place in the world, invest at each place, correspond with each place and get each information from each place via internet.
Russia has nothing common with the bolshevist, despotic unitary state, naming itself “union” (soyus), the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics USSR, also called the Soviet Union. Of course, USSR is a very important part of the history of Russia, but USSR is at the same an important part of the history of Georgia, of Ukraine and of all the other members of the former “union” as well as of the satellite states in Eastern Europe, too. All were bolshevist countries.
During the USSR time 1922 – 1991, the USSR capital Moscow was the center of the bolshevist dictatorship with Lubyanka, Comintern and other instruments. Moscow of today is completely different. Moscow is the place of the government of the Russian Federation having the job to give the 17 Million km2 country Russia with 140 Million people stability, mainly legal stability and social equity as well as international respect. Besides, Moscow of today is representing pure capitalistic fighting for assets and is a financial bubble, mainly of housing speculation, all not existing in USSR.

The persons in charge in Russia of today are pure Russians, acting and feeling as parts of a long glorious Russian history. The self-conception of president Mr. Medvedev is near to a French president, to the republican successor of the tsars, not to a Bolshevik soviet leader, not in the slightest.
The former leaders of USSR came from the bolshevist movement. The most important leaders of the 400 million people empire CCCP inclusive satellite states were the Georgian Bolshevik Iosef Vissarionovich dse Dzhugashvili, called Joseph Stalin, who created USSR, and the Georgian Bolshevik hardliners Lawrenti Pawlowitsch Beria and Grigoriy Konstantinovich Ordzhonikidze, called Sergo Ordzhonikidze, as well as the Ukrainian Bolsheviks Lev Davidovich Bronstein, called Leon Trotsky, Lazar Moiseyevich Kogan, called Kaganovich (Ukrainian famine!), Leonid Ilyich Brezhnev and Nikita Sergeyevich Khrushchev, who started his party career in the Ukraine, and the Armenian Bolshevik Anastas Hovhannesi Mikoyan. All leaders of the countries of the "union" as well as all leaders of the satellite states as GDR German Democratic Republic and others were Bolsheviks. Bolshevism was a type of civilization, independent of the country. USSR and its satellite countries were ruled by bolshevism.

The actions of the bolshevist movement were often more than violent and far away from human rights? Somebody should apologize to the victims. In Germany Mr. Oskar Lafontaine, the party chairman of the official successor party of the East German bolshevist party, supportive of the GDR, has not apologized up to now. About 160 persons were killed when they tried to scale the iron curtain wall in Berlin, hundred thousands were politically sentenced and all citizens were controlled. Mr. Lafontaine should apologize.
Who are the successors of the other former bolshevists parties in the countries of the former "union" as well as in the former satellite countries?

 
Heinrich  Bonnenberg

August 10, 2008

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If South Ossetia wants to leave Georgia, Georgia has to let them go. To forbid this leaving by military power is not acceptable.
The Russian invasion to South Ossetia is always not acceptable, as many invasions in the last decade by other countries at other places are not acceptable, too.

All troops, Georgian and Russian, should leave South Ossetia and South Ossetia should decide by itself about its future.

Last not least Georgia and Russia should pay war indemnity to South Ossetia and give help to rebuild the country.
 
Zoar  Shavit

August 10, 2008

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To Mr. Heinrich Bonnenberg:

"If South Ossetia wants to leave Georgia, Georgia has to let them go" - I am wondering about this statement made above. Such a principle does sound to be very democratic and a just principle, but can it be applicable and desirable to the world peace in today's world?

Specifically about South Ossetia it can be said that Russia was the country who in the beginning of 1990s provoked a tiny minority of South Ossetians to rebel and to split off Georgia. Thus it is common in the world that if you just give a reason and a support to any group of people (whether on ethnic background or any other background) to uprise for getting independence - most likely that such support will serve as a pretext to uprise and to wage a war, without a direct link to whether it is good or bad for such ethnic group to do so.

So should we judge the opinion of the Ossetians today (about wanting or not independence) or maybe we should examine their opinion in the past , in 1988-9 when still there was peace? If we look at their opinion today, and discover that majority hate or dislike Georgia , or wants independence from Georgia - it probably will be understandable , because such a desire supposedly emanates from the almost 20 years of confrontation with Georgia while this confrontation was clearly instigated by Russia at the time for its political imperialistic interests. And then the question arises - should Russia get this gift of having successfuly caused a quarrel between Georgiangs and Ossetians, so that today Ossetia demands independence from Georgia - thing which exactly Russia wanted ant wants?! Or maybe it is more fair to restore the brotherhood and historic strong links between the Ossetians and Georgians? I thinj that the latter is more honest way to resolve this conflict.

And generally speaking, if today we allow all ethnic minorities to quit from their countries, I am afraid there might be a huge world disorder and instead of about 200 countries that exist today, additional 200 might appear and this fact in itself will raise the danger of more and more wars between the new countries.

It is known that one of the major reasons why Russia did not let Chechnya go and become independent is the fear of Russia (I would say a justifiable fear) that if Chechnya splits off Russia, then rest republics of the North Caucasus and other autonomies of the Russian Federation will demand independance and will fight like Chechens for the independence if and when they are refused... The result will be a break-up of Russia to several parts, and such a break-up supposedly will not bring much stubility.

Therefore, I am not sure that the principle "if they want, let them go" is the right principle according to which countries today can and should decide about the question of independence. Another principle should be agreed upon I think, and this will be possible only if countries and especially superpowers will leave aside their quest for power and for more and more natural resources, which is hard to see happens in the near future.
 
Heinrich  Bonnenberg

August 10, 2008

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If a region, mainly if a state of a federation, wants to leave the country or the federation for whatever reason, it can be stopped them by all direct and indirect posibilities, with all arguments, financial aid, autonomy and so on, but really never and never and never by police or military violence, especially not by military attacks, not by war. To my understanding war in this case is a hard contradiction to human rights.
If arguments do not succeed : Let them go! Like a partner in private life!

And often, the victim is guilty for the murder and not the murderer! What have the Georgians, mainly their president, misdone in the last years? This question should really and honestly be answered in regard to Geogian NATO ambition. Fact is fact: there is (or was) war in Georgia!
 
Member deleted

August 12, 2008

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“The Russian empire is alive and well, much to the chagrin of the West. Joseph Stalin seems to have a smile on his face.”

It seems to me that the author of the article is a total fool, just like his President! What happened with South Ossetia cannot be compared with Czechoslovakia, or the Nazi Germany. On the Contrary, the Russians are doing good for the people (here I mean the South Ossetians, who were predatorily divided by Georgia [FACT] during the USSR). If not Russia, please, anyone just name me any country in this damn corrupted, double-standardized and brainwashed world that would have protected 70,000 of ethnic South Ossetians against the Georgians (who came there with only one intention: force historically opposing [FACT] ethnicity to bow to Saakashvili - the dictator, rape/kill their women/kids or face the option of total extermination in the night)??? You are thinking?! .... I already have the answer for you: There is no such a country! So, yes, what Russia did is fully justified (although, the method was wrong, but what was the other way to stop this madman - Saakashvili), apart from the civilians, who died, but, hey, can there be a war without casualties? Of course, NO! What Georgians should finally do, is wake up and nail Saakashvili, who´s leading them towards the abyss! He may preach with David´s bullshit all around, but, smart people know that he screwed it up big deal! And if he still has couple of functioning cells in his brain, he would do everyone good by resigning.

It is true people have short memory, but Saakashvili was ordered his police to tear-gass and beat the Georgians in November last year when they were protesting against his faked elections. These days he bedazzled them completely. Are you guys this easy to dupe? This reminds me of the little kid who picked a fight with a bully, got his butt whupped and then went crying home to mom. Saakashvili is really a fool if he thought Russia would stand idly by and the US would come to his aid with anything but words.

The only good things I have found out about the Georgians are hospitality and good cuisine, but the bad one is that they are known for being extremely melodramic and hitting and running away to hide behind a bigger brother (especially true to fights), which is exactly, what, happened this time with South Ossetia (FACT: it is paradoxical, but South Ossetia does not even have it´s own army).

Look at the US and how they criticize Russia. It is stupid, especially when the US has the largest record of breaking the International Law and ignoring the UN, examples are: Invasion on Iraq, Invasion on Afghanistan, Invasion of former Yugoslavia (Serbia), etc. Ha-ha ALL THESE COUNTRIES ARE SOUVEREIGN STATES (f*** you GWBush when you accuse Russia of occupying a sovereign country, look at what you did!!!), but you cannot bullshit around like this and apply double standards (Harper, Bush and the rest of the so-called "West" weren't too concerned about a cease-fire when Israeli jets were bombing all of Lebanon into rubble and killing scores of women and children. In fact Harper called the destruction of Lebanon by the Israeli military a "measured response."). There are facts and look them in the eyes and take them seriously. Setting deadly precedents (invading those countries and recognizing Kosovo) doesn’t go away easily.

That being said, I have to wonder if the Bush Administration exists outside of the realm of irony. At this very moment, we are occupying a small, defenseless nation (notably petroleum rich) which we entered without consent of the United Nations. Not only without consent, but we were specifically told NOT to do it. And then? Russia pulls a similar move (albeit one, for the sake of appearances, seems to have slightly more merit. At least their justifications exist in reality) and our administration "calls for an end to the bombing." Admittedly, I wondered to myself whether he might actually be talking about Iraq.

I am very disappointed with the level of anti-Russian, Ossetian, and Abkhasian bias that many American publications exhibit, including NYTimes. Let's talk facts here for a change because I am not hearing them from the US media. Stalin (a Georgian) has laid the foundation for this Georgian-Ossetian conflict in his time by giving Ossetian territory to his Georgian fellowmen. As the Soviet Union started disintegrating, many republics felt that they deserve the right to determine their future. However, Georgians must have been rather zealous supporters of Stalin's genocidal strategies when they brutally attacked South Ossetia in 1991 in response to its declaration of independence from Georgia and the Soviet Union. Unfortunately for Georgia, their attempts to exterminate the ethnically different Ossetians and occupy their territory failed due to a strong resistance put up by Ossetian, Abkhasian, Armenian, Chechen, and Russian fighters, among others. The recent unprovoked all-out attack by Georgia's military on the break away region the day before the Olympic games is a return to that old treacherous Stalin-inspired strategy of ethnic cleansing. What we have now is a new attempt by Georgia and the United States to exterminate the small ethnic group, deny its right for independence, and capture its territory. As an American taxpayer, you should be asking why your government has spent over $40 million of your money in equipping and training Georgian military, which has just obliterated the capital of South Ossetia and killed by some estimates about 1,400 civilians. Moreover, as an American citizen, you should be asking your government and the media why it is supporting the ethnic conflict drawn up by Stalin. This is yet another failure of the US government and the media to be honest to the American people (just like they lied to us about Iraq). I do not know about you folks, but I no longer feel that I live in a democratic country with limited government ruled by the will of its people.

To conclude, I can only add the words of Chechnya President Kadyrov who has announced that he is prepared to send 10,000 of Chechens to screw Georgians. If he really means it, then Saakashvili will probably be busy searching for a safe place at GWBush ranch to hide. The Chechen President also said that he watched CNN when they showed how Saakashvili heard the sound of a plane in Gori and abandoned the crowd of people by hiding somewhere aside. Kadyrov said that Saakashvili wasn´t even man enough to look at the jetplane, in fact he ran so fast that the Georgians need to send him to the Olympics to be a splinter there! Lol How the commander in chief can be such a coward, especially when he is supposedly giving orders to the Georgian Army??? Well, I guess every nations chooses the president it deserves, just like we deserved GWBush.
Tags: | in support of russia |
 
Heinrich  Bonnenberg

August 13, 2008

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We all have to say our very cordial thanks to the French president Nicolas Sarkozy!

Merci beaucoup!

He has attended, accepted, presented great Russia as a respectable partner of EUROPE, in spite of some faults.

Let us go ahead to build the EUROPEAN future!

 
Unregistered User

October 15, 2009

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There will be another ussr whether you like it or not. russia is the father
 

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